Just a Heads up.. Mudhole

When production rods are not enough, it's time to go custom. Come share your experiences building and/or ordering a custom rod and tell us if you'll ever go back to off the shelf.
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Mattman
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Re: Just a Heads up.. Mudhole

Postby Mattman » Fri Apr 22, 2011 3:20 am

WoodsmenRods wrote: Folks, I understand how the original poster feels. Having said that... I feel that it is poor taste for TT to sticky a thread that slams a vendor.


Tackle Tour has a history of standing up for the consumer. Sponsors have had their privileges revoked, members get banned, etc. The staff works hard to research complaints like this and will act upon the complaints. A systemic complaint will get acted upon.

This isn’t an isolated incident as you can see from the other comments.



WoodsmenRods wrote:
I see that MH now shows a picture of the cork filler, clearly identifying it as Elmers Wood Filler. So that's been fixed. Progress.


Progress…yes. Problem solved…no. The lack of remorse and the lack of a willingness to make it right are the real issue here. They’ve just put a Band-Aid on the problem.

This should have been an easy fix by Mudhole for the OP yet they chose to tweak a customer over a $7 product. What could have been and should have been a golden and inexpensive opportunity to develop a loyal customer/proponent was turned into quite the opposite.





I recently made a mistake on a customer’s rod. He had wanted the reel seat trimmed short and I just went space cadet on that detail. The customer pointed that out to me immediately upon receipt of the rod. I checked my notes and the confirmation email I had sent to him before I started building and I specified trimming the reel seat short for the build. This was 100% my mistake. I arranged and paid for shipping back to my shop. It arrived on a Friday. I fixed the customers rod on Saturday. I shipped the rod to the customer on Monday. All at my expense. The only thing my customer was out, was time with the rod.

In my “real life” I work for an $80M manufacturing company and I regularly work very closely with the customer, customer service, and operations to resolve situations with incorrect or out of spec product. Any time the customer receives the incorrect product, we break the production line to get the correct product produced, usually by the next day, and that is shipped to the customer immediately. Our standard lead time is 15 days but remakes are typically taken care of in 3 or less. And we don’t pull something off the shelf, we’re a manufacturer, we have to make it. The customer is also refunded immediately for their incorrect product and the freight they had to pay to receive it. Most of this product is shipped common carrier on pallets so freight is a significant expense. Taking care of the customer is #1.

EVERYBODY makes mistakes. The manner in which they are resolved is what defines your character, not the mistake itself.
Matt Davis
Otterods-High performance fishing rods

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USA-RET
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Re: Just a Heads up.. Mudhole

Postby USA-RET » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:27 am

WoodsmenRods wrote:Folks, I understand how the original poster feels. Having said that... I feel that it is poor taste for TT to sticky a thread that slams a vendor.

Sorry you feel that way. It's a hardly a slam IMO. Unless of course, you think this issue was handled properly. :D

To the original poster - I agree, it was misleading. Point taken. Did you ask if you could return it?



In fact, I did. Return shipping would be at my expense (as per their policy). Lets figure $4 to return the item compared to the $7 it cost me originally.

So I get $7 dollars back from them. I'm still out $7 (original shipping). Of course we understand this, but still a rubbing point since the product was misrepresented.

My return postage $4 to Mudhole to get a check from them for $7. I now have to buy the item locally for $5.

Lets see, $7 check from Mudhole minus $5 for the item locally....hey, I made out on the return... WOOT! $2 ahead ..oh wait :-k ..it cost me $4 to return it. I'm out another $2 for THEIR error.

I told their customer service Rep exactly that. By me returning this, it was going to cost me more money due to their misrepresentation. I was told that she was sorry for the mistake.

Had I returned the merchandise, I'd being throwing more good money after bad. Maybe their return policy works better with a high dollar item..but not with Elmer's Wood Filler.

For the low dollar item we are talking about here, and it's not the money, it's the principle and the customer service/support.

Them knowing that it was going to cost me (their customer) more to resolve their error (or misrepresentation) I'd have expected a slightly different approach.

I fully expected them to apologize, offer to return the purchase price of the item to me and not ask for a return (keep it, our mistake, we are so sorry). Or if they really wanted the item back, to offer to pay return shipping and return my entire amount (including original shipping). That's the way a first class company operates IMO. Make an exception to normal policy when it's their mistake and the customer is not at fault.

Most companies will eat a small dollar amounts to make customers happy and to foster goodwill regardless of published policy, especially when it's clearly their mistake.

Had they done this, I'd have posted that result here instead.




I pasted in the policy from the website at the bottom of this post. You knew you had to pay shipping, correct? The shipping charge is indicated on the checkout page. I heard on RBO that the MH filler was Elmers. So I ran downtown to buy some. It took three stores before I found it. Not always so easy. I probably burned $5 is gas. ;)


Yeah, appreciate you posting it. I got that..I knew I was paying shipping. I was buying cork filler from them. Something I could not find locally. Something to fix the cork on my fishing rods.

I'll pay their price and the shipping for that item, not for locally available wood filler. I did in fact opt to purchase their product, accept their terms, and pay the stated charges believing I was getting cork filler. Just like their website indicated.

Sorry to hear you had problems finding your wood filler locally. My Ace Hardware store had it for $5.95 and they normally price things higher than other outlets.


I see that MH now shows a picture of the cork filler, clearly identifying it as Elmers Wood Filler. So that's been fixed. Progress.

Certainly getting the correct product pictured on their web page is progress for sure. Something one would have expected from the onset.

Had they displayed the correct picture initially, I'd have reasoned I could buy the same product locally and would have done so, saving myself approximately $12 in additional charges and the aggravation.


I have ordered from numerous vendors. One that is recommended by some on TT has given me fits! Forgot items, won't return emails and calls, etc. I just buy somewhere else - I don't take it online. Keep in mind that those are human beings working at these places. They have bad days, and they screw up. The trouble is, when they do, everyone on the internet forums hears about it.


Certainly they are human and can make mistakes. This goes beyond that. That service rep had to go off the phone to get an answer to my question, "Why I received the wrong merchandise?". The response she got from her supervisor was the one I received. Had someone told her to handle it differently, she would have done that too. So there were at least two people having a bad day or unable to think clearly and/or are screwing up.

Giving any of these places a pass for bad customer service only allows that same bad behavior to continue.



I would challenge you to find an online dealer with a nicer website and better inventory than MH, and no, I am not affiliated with them in any way.

FYI - I have returned two blanks that just didn't work out for me. Both were high dollar blanks. No restocking fee. I had one customer rod fail that was built on a MH blank. I sent several pictures. I received emails from two different MH staff people, and both of them apologized for my situation. They put a replacement in the mail that I received 4 days later - no charge of course.

If Mud Hole did not honor the policies on the website, then you have a valid complaint.

They followed their policy to the letter without regard to how the policy affected their customer. Even though the mistake was clearly theirs.
For me, they get a failing grade, regardless of the 100% satisfaction guarantee.


Chuck Mills
Woodsmen Rods

From Mud Hole site:
100% SATISFACTION GUARANTEE

We personally guarantee that all the items we sell will meet with your personal satisfaction. If for any reason you are not fully satisfied with your purchase, please call us within seven day of receipt to receive a return merchandise authorization number (RMA) and return your products to us in their original condition and a full refund will be issued. Click here to learn more about requesting a return.

RETURN POLICY

If for any reason you are not satisfied with your purchase, you may return the item to us within 30 days. Returns may be requested by emailing our returns department at returns@mudhole.com or by phone at (407) 447-7637. You will be provided with a return merchandise authorization (RMA) number and instructions for sending the product(s) back to us. Please have the Invoice number available. Please note the following:

Mud Hole Custom Tackle reserves its right to charge a 10% restocking fee on all returns.
To obtain the RMA number, please provide us with the invoice number and reason for the return.
Once you receive a return authorization you may return unused items in the original box with all accessories within 7 days for an exchange or refund.
Mud Hole Custom Tackle will not accept returned merchandise without a return authorization (RMA) number. This number must be posted in a conspicuous place on the outside of the package.
Merchandise must include a copy of your invoice or packing slip. Defective merchandise should be returned directly to the manufacturer under their return policy.
Shipping and handling is non-refundable.
Please allow up to 2 weeks for credit for returned items.
Shipping for returned merchandise must be prepaid by the customer
Books, videos and software sales are final.
Special orders may not be returned.

Damaged Packages - If the package was damaged in shipping refuse shipment or make sure the driver notes the damage on the delivery ticket. Save all original damaged packaging material and merchandise for the carrier to inspect.
~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~
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neffrental1
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Re: Just a Heads up.. Mudhole

Postby neffrental1 » Fri Apr 29, 2011 8:41 am

USA-RET your whole problem lies with your statement “Call them to complain told them had I known this was the product I was getting, I'd have gone to Lowes or Home Depot and paid $5 w/ no shipping” Your pissed because YOU could not STEEL someone else’s idea for FREE! You wanted Cork filler – you got it!! Stop ranting because it was made by Elmers – who cares who made it, it works as cork filler. Mud Hole took the time, money, trial and error, testing, research and development, etc to find that plan old Elmer’s Golden Oak color works as a great cork filler. You’re pissed because you had to spend a few dollars more than the same product is sold at Home Depot for to gain someone else’s intellectual property. You’re a plan old thief who’s complaining he could not steel someone else’s property for free.

I got news for you – do you think the epoxy’s you use are actually a proprietary chemical make up? Nope, it common epoxy used in other industries for hundreds of uses – I even bet they sell it a Lowes for half the price. It’s just the “reseller” has it bottled for them so YOU cannot tell who made it. Mud Hole’s only fault in this was keeping it in the original Elmers bottle.

More news – do you think the tread you use daily in rod building is made just for rod building – better guess again – go down to your favourite sewing store – the same thread can be purchased a quarter the price.

Shall we keep going – how about the epoxy mixing cups, or those little yellow epoxy brushes, a china marker, masking tape, drywall arbor tape, etc – none of these items a proprietary nor made exclusively for any rod building vendor. All of them could be purchased a Lowes – so following your logic the all vendors are bad and misleading because they don’t tell you where the items come from.

Mud Hole sent you what ordered. Their shipping costs are clearly stated – after all you agreed to them a checkout. Their return policy is clearly stated – “shipping is not refundable”. The cork filler works as promised. You got what you ordered – end of story. Again – you’re a common thief who’s pissed because you don’t want to pay for someone’s’ intellectual property.

Standard disclaimer – I’m not associated with mud hole, but I have been a very satisfied customer of theirs for years. I too have had far worst experiences with other vendors, that’s why I keep coming back to mud hole. This post and TTW by making it sticky is doing a dis-service to a fine company.

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Re: Just a Heads up.. Mudhole

Postby USA-RET » Sat Apr 30, 2011 9:43 am

neffrental1 wrote:USA-RET your whole problem lies with your statement “Call them to complain told them had I known this was the product I was getting, I'd have gone to Lowes or Home Depot and paid $5 w/ no shipping” Your pissed because YOU could not STEEL someone else’s idea for FREE! You wanted Cork filler – you got it!! Stop ranting because it was made by Elmers – who cares who made it, it works as cork filler. Mud Hole took the time, money, trial and error, testing, research and development, etc to find that plan old Elmer’s Golden Oak color works as a great cork filler. You’re pissed because you had to spend a few dollars more than the same product is sold at Home Depot for to gain someone else’s intellectual property. You’re a plan old thief who’s complaining he could not steel someone else’s property for free.

I got news for you – do you think the epoxy’s you use are actually a proprietary chemical make up? Nope, it common epoxy used in other industries for hundreds of uses – I even bet they sell it a Lowes for half the price. It’s just the “reseller” has it bottled for them so YOU cannot tell who made it. Mud Hole’s only fault in this was keeping it in the original Elmers bottle.

More news – do you think the tread you use daily in rod building is made just for rod building – better guess again – go down to your favourite sewing store – the same thread can be purchased a quarter the price.

Shall we keep going – how about the epoxy mixing cups, or those little yellow epoxy brushes, a china marker, masking tape, drywall arbor tape, etc – none of these items a proprietary nor made exclusively for any rod building vendor. All of them could be purchased a Lowes – so following your logic the all vendors are bad and misleading because they don’t tell you where the items come from.

Mud Hole sent you what ordered. They actually didn't. Their shipping costs are clearly stated – after all you agreed to them a checkout. Their return policy is clearly stated – “shipping is not refundable”. The cork filler works as promised Wood filler does work. You got what you ordered Actually I didn't, I ordered cork filler, which was clearly shown on their website when I ordered. and they sent me a locally available wood filler as a substitute– end of story Yes it is, for any future dealings with Mudhole :D . Again – you’re a common thief who’s pissed because you don’t want to pay for someone’s’ intellectual property. Only if you say so :lol:

Standard disclaimer – I’m not associated with mud hole, :lol: but I have been a very satisfied customer of theirs for years. I too have had far worst experiences with other vendors, that’s why I keep coming back to mud hole. This post and TTW by making it sticky is doing a dis-service to a fine company.


No comment, this guy's illogical post speaks for itself (beyond all reason though) :doh:


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