UL Reel Spool's "LIP" - Shimano vs Daiwa

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ultralight
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UL Reel Spool's "LIP" - Shimano vs Daiwa

Post by ultralight » Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:08 pm

I've only had Daiwa reels, such as the 1003 Presso and Luvias, along with other USA models.

Some years back, Shimano changed their spool edges to be a sort of a 'Cone' shape which is wider than the Daiwa whcih is just a thin lip. They have kept that shape all these years and Daiwa has not followed suit.

Anyone know if the Shimano edge really helps or not? It seems that the flared cone would make the line go wider coming off the spool and actually reduce casting distance as it then creates more drag as it hit the first guide at a wider angle. Not so?

I load my line right up to the edge of the spools so at casting, it just shoot more straight out towards the first guide without going too far outwards in a spiral. This does take a bit of awareness in line management but so I've gotten used to us.

Wondering about the Shimano. Thanks.

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Re: UL Reel Spool's "LIP" - Shimano vs Daiwa

Post by hoohoorjoo » Wed Oct 17, 2018 4:46 pm

Shimano calls that their "Propulsion Line Management". The reels I've owned pre- and post-"propulsion" had similar casting distances. Okuma tapered the edges of their spools in a similar fashion several yrs before Shimano did it. I always thought it was just hype, the same way they 'invented' the "X-Ship" technology. :roll: In both cases, a new name for old tech imho. But they do whatever it takes catch fish(ermen). But I'm not hating, because Shimano has always made a fine product. I guess I'm just stating the obvious :lol:
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Re: UL Reel Spool's "LIP" - Shimano vs Daiwa

Post by Bronzeye » Wed Oct 17, 2018 5:20 pm

One can fill a Daiwa spinning reel to quite close to the lip because of the spool's reverse taper, which I think is a Daiwa-patented feature. Doing that with a level-filled spool--or worse, one that tapers toward the rotor--invites frequent casting snarls.

Because other makes have to start with the line that is near the spool lip being farther down towards the core from the lip, some use a taper, presumably to reduce friction as that close-to-the-lip spooled line is pulled over the lip by the outgoing lure.

In the case of very soft braided lines, that taper might well reduce leaving-the-spool friction significantly. I doubt that is so with nylon and fluorocarbon monofilament lines, though, as they have enough body to want to spring off the spool and might never touch the spool lip regardless of lip design.

I'd like to see slow-motion footage of wet nylon line coming off a spinning spool in a cast. I've seen slo-mo footage used to show the benefits of Fuji and Microwave guide trains, but I don't recall whether the Fuji footage let you see the spinning reel lip (and if it did show that with nylon line, the line was probably bone-dry for the indoor camera work) and I think the Microwave footage was only made with braided line.

Ultralight (the original poster), if the type of line being used and its state of wetness don't result in it touching the spool lip as it unwinds, then a tapered lip won't act as the ski jump ramp you envision. If some of the line does touch the lip, it is probably only going to be the line wound closest to the spool lip, and in that case the reduced lip friction for line near the front of the spool might offset whatever guide friction might increase due to some ski-jump effect inducing wider spiraling of outgoing line.

This is armchair theorizing--all I can do now because I won't be fishing for at least several days. Let's hear from someone who can cast Daiwa and Shimano spools of similar size with the same type of line and tell us what he observes!

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Re: UL Reel Spool's "LIP" - Shimano vs Daiwa

Post by Bronzeye » Wed Oct 17, 2018 5:29 pm

I must have been just starting to type my reply as hoohoorjoo posted his. He says he got the same casting distance from Shimano spools (presumably the same size) with a thin lip as he did with those having a tapered lip. That suggests there's no practical difference.

Others' experience? Links to videos of outgoing line?

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Re: UL Reel Spool's "LIP" - Shimano vs Daiwa

Post by uljersey » Wed Oct 17, 2018 5:44 pm

A coat of car wax on the line contact area of the lip will reduce friction even further. We're not talking huge gains here, but every little bit helps.

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Re: UL Reel Spool's "LIP" - Shimano vs Daiwa

Post by hoohoorjoo » Wed Oct 17, 2018 5:53 pm

Bronzeye wrote:.....the same casting distance from Shimano spools (presumably the same size) with a thin lip as he did with those having a tapered lip. That suggests there's no practical difference.
Yes, both reels were Symetre 2500 size reels(FI and FJ series), both used with 20# 832 braid. Not sure about the 1000 size reels, because Ive only owned an older Twinpower in that size.
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Re: UL Reel Spool's "LIP" - Shimano vs Daiwa

Post by slipperybob » Mon Dec 24, 2018 12:20 am

I can't speak for the Shimano vs Daiwa, but for the Shimano before "Propulsion Line Management" vs then and now.

It's easier to gauge line filling the spool. Thus you get better results. And you reduce the line angle closest to the spool lip.

In terms of spool lip alone, a totally round curve spool lip equal to the curve of a circle would probably be physically best. It's gauging the line fill that is harder to do with the naked eye. At least in my case.

There is a point where smaller spools and the efficiency of max cast distance drops for gains in efficiency of short cast distance. There is a trade off. Being a long time user of Stradic 1000 series. Some has a slightly smaller spool lip like the FbMg then compared to some with a slightly larger spool lip like the Ci4+ spools.
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