Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

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aquaholik
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Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby aquaholik » Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:54 am

The 20 lbs 8 strand Maxima Braid ABS came in at 30.45 and 28.25 lbs in two test for an average of 29.35 lbs.

Line mass came in at 14mg/ft so the actual diameter is .0103 in VS the listed .009 in.

The line S/W is closest to Spiderwire Ultracast 15 lbs. Same feel, same, diameter and breaking strength.

Hopefully the line last longer than Spiderwire Ultracast 15 lbs. That line breaks down fast after about 100 hours of constant casting and jigging.

Thank you to Yumeya for sending me the sample.

Edit: at 14mg/ft, it's also the same mass as Seaguar Smackdown 30 lbs and the new Sunline Xplasma Asegai in 18 lbs. So similar diameter but better ABS.

Paulus list 30 lbs Seaguar smackdown at .258 mm for diameter. We found the mass of that line to be 14.0 mg/ft and derived the diameter at .262 mm, a 2% difference.
Last edited by aquaholik on Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby slipperybob » Sat Aug 25, 2018 11:09 am

Thanks again for testing.
slip bobbing is the laziest way to fish

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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby BRONZEBACK32 » Sat Aug 25, 2018 9:00 pm

Glad to provide you with line :big grin:

aquaholik
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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby aquaholik » Sun Aug 26, 2018 6:06 am

BRONZEBACK32 wrote:Glad to provide you with line :big grin:


That was you all these time. I thought I saw a Yumeya on this forum also. Maybe it was another bass fishing forum.

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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby Bronzeye » Sun Aug 26, 2018 8:51 am

Aquaholic,

To calculate the diameter of a braided line from a mass-per-foot measurement, it seems to me that one would have to know the density of the line as braided (hard to figure, with a microscopic hills-and-valleys surface texture created by braid bundles), whether the cross-section is a perfect circle or a rectangle or square, and, if coated with a dye, the density and thickness of that coating. I don't think you know all those things, so I question diameter figures calculated thus.

Second, one cannot conclude from the fact that two braids have the same mass per foot that they must have the same diameter. The tightness and roundness of the braiding and the thickness of a coating of different density than the braid material could result in quite different diameters.

What was the leader material to which the FG knot was tied? Am I right in thinking that the two break figures you gave were in tests involving FG knots, and if so, did the FG knots fail or did the breaks occur in the braid away from the knot?

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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby aquaholik » Sun Aug 26, 2018 4:17 pm

The density of water is 1g / cubic cm. The density of spectra is .97 g / cubic cm. So it floats. All of them. That means the Maximum density of any braid is .97 g/ cubic cm. But not all braids are woven that tight. I sent Paulus lots of line. Based on his measurement of diameter and my mass measurement of the same exact sample I concluded that .85 g/ cubic cm is a good number to use. For unifilament line like Nanofil, it's density is probably closer to the maximum of .97 g/ cubic cm. For loose weave or 4 strand line, maybe .70 is a better number. If I assign a maximum density to each sample, it would mean that the diameter I derived is the smallest diameter possible. That means if you thread the braid thru the glass tube, you would need a glass tube with at least the derived diameter.

Playing with the formula, the difference between .85 and .97 leads to a decrease of 6% in diameter. So at most, the braid is 6% smaller than the derived diameter assuming you weave or and compress it as tight as possible.

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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby aquaholik » Sun Aug 26, 2018 5:10 pm

For the FG knot test, a mono leader of higher ABS is always used to force the break on the braid. In most cases 30 lbs Suffix Superior monofilament whose ABS is 48 lbs is used to tie to braids that are labeled 20 lbs and under.

On casual observation, the FG knot always break right at the last half hitches. Marking the main line with a permanent marker right at the last half hitches and testing to failure reveals that it actually breaks somewhere under the half hitches or somewhere along the last few wraps used to form the FG. So there is anywhere from 2 to 6 inches of main line past the marked point under the wraps.

FG knot is 80-90 percent when the ABS of the braid is under 30 lbs. Line like Gliss and Nanofil up to 24 lbs ABS have FG knot strength that is 90-95%. Under actual use, it's not uncommon to see the main line breaking WELL AWAY from the FG knot. That is because line consistency is never 100%. Tie a 95% FG knot on the thickest section and the thinnest section somewhere between the snag and the reel will break first. Hence a 100% knot is never an ideal knot when fishing from land and making long cast where a snag might occur.

From testing 100s of FG and PR knots, the PR knot is the only knot next to a perfectly tied bimini that actually breaks close to 100% of ABS.
Last edited by aquaholik on Sun Aug 26, 2018 5:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

aquaholik
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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby aquaholik » Sun Aug 26, 2018 5:14 pm

Looks like I forgot to include FG knot strength of the Maxima 20 lbs braid in the first post.



FG knot is 23.21 and 23.90 for an average of 23.56 lbs = 80 % FG knot strength

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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby Bronzeye » Sun Aug 26, 2018 6:12 pm

Thanks for these replies, which answer the questions I posed in the last paragraph of my post and provide interesting additional information.

You had not previously indicated in this thread that you were taking into consideration diameters actually measured by someone else, rather than just calculated, and that factored into my skepticism.

As you now acknowledge, braid densities can vary by tightness of braid. They can also differ by number of carriers, which affects the shape of the braid. Some braids are ribbonlike, and most have rectangular cross-sections; in these cases, caliper measurements will probably measure the thinner dimension because the braid would collapse or turn if measured on end (wider dimension up). Caliper measurements of braid are hard to make accurately because of its compressibility. Also, as I mentioned earlier, we don't know the density of coatings of dye or lubricant, and that would affect density more in braids where each fiber bundle is coated before braiding than in those that might be coated after braiding. Green and yellow dyes might differ in density. An undyed (white or "crystal") superline should be thinner than a coated version of the same brand. All of these considerations point to the difficulty of either directly measuring or indirectly calculating a single reliable "diameter" measurement for a braid. And in the Nanofil lines I own, thickness variations are easily visible in portions of the line inches apart.

I appreciate your efforts to gather and share information. I was pleased to read that the FG knot works so well with Gliss, as I did not find other knots to perform well with that slick line.

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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby aquaholik » Sun Aug 26, 2018 6:40 pm

Right.

The labeled diameter is probably the thinnest cross section measured with a digital caliper. The braid is stretch and the line is now roughly rectangular. Let's say the stretched braid is 2x4x12 inch. The manufacturer labels it as 2 inch diameter, and Paulus averages it and say it's a 3 inch diameter braid. The volume of the braid is 96 cubic inches. Paulus say it's 84.78 cubic inches. For Paulus to be correct, the diameter must actually be greater than 3 inches. So Paulus is already giving the manufacturer the benefit of the doubt with his measurement which is ALWAYS larger than the labeled diameter. The actual diameter would be 3.20 inches in order for it to occupy a volume of 96 cubic inches.

The number we derived accurately represent how much line you can fit into a spool if wound 100% tight. We are essentially saying what the braid diameter would be if we force it thru the smallest round glass tube possible.

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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby BRONZEBACK32 » Sun Aug 26, 2018 7:03 pm

aquaholik wrote:
BRONZEBACK32 wrote:Glad to provide you with line :big grin:


That was you all these time. I thought I saw a Yumeya on this forum also. Maybe it was another bass fishing forum.



Its on another bass forum :big grin:

aquaholik
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Re: Maxima Braid Ultragreen 20 lbs ABS and FG knot test

Postby aquaholik » Sun Aug 26, 2018 7:10 pm

BRONZEBACK32 wrote:
aquaholik wrote:
BRONZEBACK32 wrote:Glad to provide you with line :big grin:


That was you all these time. I thought I saw a Yumeya on this forum also. Maybe it was another bass fishing forum.



Its on another bass forum :big grin:


I thought I was senile for a moment.


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