What's next for Daiwa...

[SSS]

What? How does the magentic flux density does not change throughout the cast on daiwa reels? What does the spool inductor going in and out of the magnets on the side plate is doing? The flux doesn't change on linear magnets seen on Chinese manufactured reels and Abu reels. Same applies to daiwa/megabass spools with a fixed inductor. But the flux does change on non fixed inductors from daiwa.

[LowRange]

Just found it ironic that magnetic controls aren't so bad if they are necessary for DC reels (and Shimano's Finesse Tune Brake). Shimano's finesse tune brake is for sure less innovative than SV magnetic reels.

I do agree though somewhat and wish Daiwa would innovate more, rather than "refresh" models and platform upgrades. I still don't think the newest SVS braking is moved past Daiwa's SV tech though.

There is a huge difference.

As with Daiwa, the magentic flux density does not change throughout the cast. It is the same at all times- at the top of the cast, in the middle of the cast, and at the tail end of the cast. The magnetic "grab" on the spool is constant. No change what so ever.

This is the same old thing that has been inside of reels for 40 years. Nothing new under the sun there except for packaging and repackaging.

But if you look over at Shimano with the DC reel, it does not use magnets for the braking. It uses magnets for the generation of electrical power to energize the computer microprocessor circuitry that watches the rotation speed of the spool throughout the cast and applies braking only as needed. Not a constant magnetic grab on the spool like Daiwa.

Here is what Shimano says about the DC:

"Shimano’s new Digital Control braking system utilizes a microcomputer to monitor spool speed 1,000 times every second and apply the perfect amount of brake to prevent backlash and maximize distance. Anglers of all skill levels will appreciate less thumbing and trouble-free casting in all conditions."

Computer controlled VARIABLE braking as NEEDED! Huge difference between constant magnet strength and variably applied braking as needed.

So there is something new under the sun, but it does not say Daiwa.

What Daiwa does is repackage, repackage, repackage the same old thing for decades. Different color paint schemes, shave the spools down and make them pretty colors, change the shape of the reel, use more plastic parts, etc. But in the end nothing new.

So this is why I said above I did not expect anything new from them. Daiwa is still using magnets same as we have seen for 40 years but Shimano is now putting computers inside of reels and generators. I just purchased a Shimano Curado DC and waiting on the mailman to deliver!

I don't know about you, but I don't want constant strength magnetic flux density throughout the cast when it is not needed, but Daiwa has no way to turn off the magnets. It is what it is.

I am left wondering when and if Daiwa will ever make the leaps into the future Shimano has done.

I would also like to point out that you are wrong. The Magforce Z, Magforce V and Air Brake do not function like other magnetic brakes and are more similar in operation to a centrifugal brake reel than other non Daiwa magnetic brakes. I like centrifugal brakes but they are far from high tech. They are ancient and predate Daiwa Magforce Z and Air Brake. The notion they are more advanced tech is laughable at best. The Shimano SVS and VBS centrifugal brakes are much less sophisticated by comparison but still quite good. The DC reels are a different story. They are really cool tech.

[timinmo]

I own and fish with both and other than brand loyalty I can not say one is dramatically better than the other for general purposes. I do think the SV spool was a rather dramatic improvement and forced Shimano to bring DC to a lower priced package. Overall to me they both have strengths and if I am not mistaken I believe my Calcutta BFS has magnets in it just like my Pixy SPR has a centrifugal brake in it. In the end if I am determined to have a particular braking system I am going to miss out on some really cool reels that have a different system.

[LgMouthGambler]

Sorry Shimanofan, but you are on the wrong forum to be making such inaccurate statements about how Daiwas magnetic braking system works. Its quite an advancement over centrifugal brakes that Shimano uses. Not to say the Shimano centrifugal brakes are bad, because I like the VBS system, but not on par with Magforce Z/SV of Daiwa. Oh, and DC uses magnets.

[Big-Bass]

A smaller "Z" and a Type-R SV103 (which I read in another post) would be awesome for sure!

[DirtyD64]

Sorry Shimanofan, but you are on the wrong forum to be making such inaccurate statements about how Daiwas magnetic braking system works. Its quite an advancement over centrifugal brakes that Shimano uses. Not to say the Shimano centrifugal brakes are bad, because I like the VBS system, but not on par with Magforce Z/SV of Daiwa. Oh, and DC uses magnets.

Yeah, no pun intended but I almost "bit" the hook he was throwing out. With a name like that and claiming "leaps" ahead of Daiwa I have decided to let the troll go hungry. Must not be the most fresh on tech either, because Daiwa braking definitely retracts from magnets. One of the few if only magnet systems that use centrifugal force to pull away at that. I tried to explain it a while back from my light engineering in college, DC braking acts by charging (via copper coil and moving magnet), then sending info to small processor (spool speed based on energy created), then redistributing that energy back through the coil to form magnetism on the spool to a selected level by the fisherman. Not super complex but truly amazing and all props given. I might be off slightly, but I'm pretty sure that is how it gets it done.

[ShimanoFan]

I would also like to point out that you are wrong. The Magforce Z, Magforce V and Air Brake do not function like other magnetic brakes and are more similar in operation to a centrifugal brake reel than other non Daiwa magnetic brakes. I like centrifugal brakes but they are far from high tech. They are ancient and predate Daiwa Magforce Z and Air Brake. The notion they are more advanced tech is laughable at best. The Shimano SVS and VBS centrifugal brakes are much less sophisticated by comparison but still quite good. The DC reels are a different story. They are really cool tech.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion of course.

https://japantackle.com/tackle_topics/brake_system.htm

"Conclusion

I used to conclude Mag Force V and Z system of Daiwa is the most advanced brake system currently available for fishing reels. What makes it the most advanced is the ability to address the requirements at all speed ranges, and relatively wide adjusting range at middle speed, without using computer. The Flying Arm, IVCB comes to the second, a little a head of 4x4 SVS, because of continuous adjusting range. Shimano's SVS, Conventional magnet, Combination of magnet and centrifugal will come next. Although SVS is very refined system, troubles of changing setting is a large drawbacks. If you don't cast against wind, SVS will come close to 4x4 SVS though. This conclusion doesn't immediately mean that the reel with Mag Force V is the best fishing reel. Performances of casting reels are affected by more factors, like inertia of spool, smoothness of ball bearings, stiffness of frame, weight and etc. I admit Shimano's SVS casts very well in normal conditions, and I love it."

I tend to agree with Japan tackle... again, just perception is not always real world, or in this case reel world.

[poisonokie]

[ShimanoFan]

Yeah, no pun intended but I almost "bit" the hook he was throwing out. With a name like that and claiming "leaps" ahead of Daiwa I have decided to let the troll go hungry. Must not be the most fresh on tech either, because Daiwa braking definitely retracts from magnets. One of the few if only magnet systems that use centrifugal force to pull away at that.

Troll? Seriously?

This is a discussion forum. And we are just talking about little old fishing reels. Nothing important really.

Your unpleasantness indicates a lack of willingness to hear differing opinions. We see this in the democrat party today. No differing points of view allowed. And they they show up at Tucker Carlson's house to let him know it too! Lay off the personal disagreements. I am not doing it to anyone, so why is this even happening here? It is not suppose to.

Are people suppose to be encouraged to post or run off by one sided opinions and name calling? Don't let this place be like other forums where new members are run off because someone does not like a particular opinion. We are suppose to be adults. Or, are we?

Rotational speed varies between fishermen. No two humans cast alike. But the reels are all alike?

The one spring Daiwa uses is where your whole case revolves around. Shimano is now using computers inside of reels. Daiwa is trusting one spring. I don't. I might want the inductor to stay out longer than the spring will allow. Can't adjust for that! I have to adjust to the reel. I like having a reel that adjusts to me. Is that OK around here without the bashing on a personal level?

I've been doing this longer than Matt has even been alive. Its not rocket science.

[LgMouthGambler]

Oh lordy. I know who this guy is. Now it makes sense. You are a oil change tech compared to these Master Mechanics on this forum. Trust me, you dont want to trg them. Even if you work in a service shop, you are moot of the knowledge most on this site have about baitcasters, especially Daiwas and Shimanos.

[ShimanoFan]

Thanks for the compliment Matt! Its not rocket science even though I did contract work for NASA and military and Disney and Universal in another life...

At least I work for a place where the major brands train us plus near 40 years of experience- means nothing if the opinion is not liked.

I got it. Put me down. I see how this works. Don't like the opinion, so the person with the dissenting opinion is bad.

Do you work for any major brands? Have you ever been trained by any major brands? Are you a trained warranty repair tech?

Please tell all of us where your expertise comes from? The kitchen table repair shop? "No honey, we can't use the kitchen table for dinner! I have a Daiwa reel in parts on it tonight!" Don't mess up the order or I might not get it back together right!

Got it. And you don't touch spinning reels either. That makes an expert!

I never said I was an expert like you do. I just offer an opinion on a discussion forum is all. I thought this was a place for simple informal discussion on reels among adults. Looks like I am wrong all the way around.

I did not realize I had to have your opinion in order to discuss these things.

Matt do you realize how many new members you run off forums with this type of thing? The question is why? These forums are businesses needing new members and new money to keep them going. Running off people because you don't like their opinions is just wrong- here and elsewhere. Just ask some new members who stopped posting and why that is if you care.

I did nothing wrong here. The name calling and personal attacks is what is wrong here.

You can't even stay on topic. This type of thing renders discussion forums moot.

[Big-Bass]

So what reels are we all expecting rather than getting into a match about politics, mechanics, etc...easy it's just a Sunday morning!

[ShimanoFan]

So what reels are we all expecting rather than getting into a match about politics, mechanics, etc...easy it's just a Sunday morning!

Agree.

[LgMouthGambler]

Thanks for the compliment Matt!

At least I work for a place where the major brands train us plus near 40 years of experience- means nothing if the opinion is not liked.

I got it. Put me down. I see how this works. Don't like the opinion, so the person with the dissenting opinion is bad.

Do you work for any major brands? Have you ever been trained by any major brands? Are you a trained warranty repair tech?

Please tell all of us where your expertise comes from? The kitchen table repair shop? "No honey, we can't use the kitchen table for dinner! I have a Daiwa reel in parts on it tonight!" Don't mess up the order or I might not get it back together right!

Got it. And you don't touch spinning reels either. That makes an expert!

I never said I was an expert like you do. I just offer an opinion on a discussion forum is all. I thought this was a place for simple informal discussion on reels among adults. Looks like I am wrong all the way around.

I did not realize I had to have your opinion in order to discuss these things.

Matt do you realize how many new members you run off forums with this type of thing? The question is why? These forums are businesses needing new members and new money to keep them going. Running off people because you don't like their opinions is just wrong.

I did nothing wrong here. The name calling and personal attacks is what is wrong here.

You can't even stay on topic. This type of thing renders discussion forums moot.

I dont run people off. Its people like yourself that run yourself off. You havent made much of friends on other forums, and you probably wont make many here either. This aint UB, these are enthusiasts, not your average Joes. Im just saying, tread lightly here.

[iabass8]

Yeah, no pun intended but I almost "bit" the hook he was throwing out. With a name like that and claiming "leaps" ahead of Daiwa I have decided to let the troll go hungry. Must not be the most fresh on tech either, because Daiwa braking definitely retracts from magnets. One of the few if only magnet systems that use centrifugal force to pull away at that.

Troll? Seriously?

This is a discussion forum. And we are just talking about little old fishing reels. Nothing important really.

Your unpleasantness indicates a lack of willingness to hear differing opinions. We see this in the democrat party today. No differing points of view allowed. And they they show up at Tucker Carlson's house to let him know it too! Lay off the personal disagreements. I am not doing it to anyone, so why is this even happening here? It is not suppose to.

Are people suppose to be encouraged to post or run off by one sided opinions and name calling? Don't let this place be like other forums where new members are run off because someone does not like a particular opinion. We are suppose to be adults. Or, are we?

Rotational speed varies between fishermen. No two humans cast alike. But the reels are all alike?

The one spring Daiwa uses is where your whole case revolves around. Shimano is now using computers inside of reels. Daiwa is trusting one spring. I don't. I might want the inductor to stay out longer than the spring will allow. Can't adjust for that! I have to adjust to the reel. I like having a reel that adjusts to me. Is that OK around here without the bashing on a personal level?

I've been doing this longer than Matt has even been alive. Its not rocket science.

We get it...you or your shop or whatever were just "certified to service Daiwa reels" or you had some Daiwa reel tech show you something or whatever. What you need to realize is you are coming to place /w people that have been servicing, tuning, repairing, customizing, etc Daiwa and shimano reels for decades. You are coming across as a high school kid who just read his first history book and wants to talk about how he knows everything about ww2 /w people who were actually there. I'm and others aren't saying you aren't capable of fixing reels but your first few posts about how Daiwa braking system works was so wrong (as it was pointed out 2-3 times already so I won't rehash it for you) it's hard to take what you're saying seriously. Your posts just seem to all say "lol magnets are stupid and i want a computer to control my reel." Braking systems are obviously a matter of personal preference but there is more information and knowledge on Mag Z, Mag V, 3D braking, SV spools, what certain spools do in certain reels /w certain braking profiles, etc on here than you will ever learn from some dude at Daiwa. Do yourself a favor and just read if you want to learn.