13 fishing CZB Bearing

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BRONZEBACK32
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13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby BRONZEBACK32 » Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:05 pm

Anyone gonna order these bearings to see how they work with a Shimano/Daiwa?

Scroll down, it looks like the bearings are $11.00 each
http://www.13fishing.com/concept-z/

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johnD
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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby johnD » Thu Jan 04, 2018 9:09 pm

Is it a bearing or a bushing , it looks like a bushing ? I'll let somebody else be the guinea pig..

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby BRONZEBACK32 » Thu Jan 04, 2018 11:13 pm

johnD wrote:Is it a bearing or a bushing , it looks like a bushing ? I'll let somebody else be the guinea pig..


CZB bushing/bearing.....whatever 13 fishing calls it.

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johnD
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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby johnD » Fri Jan 05, 2018 7:34 am

Well , before icast they advertised it being a zero bearing reel...now they call the bushing a bearing. I am confused. :-k

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby fati » Fri Jan 05, 2018 7:55 am

johnD wrote:Well , before icast they advertised it being a zero bearing reel...now they call the bushing a bearing. I am confused. :-k


i had the same thought... ](*,)

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby mark poulson » Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:04 am

fati wrote:
johnD wrote:Well , before icast they advertised it being a zero bearing reel...now they call the bushing a bearing. I am confused. :-k


i had the same thought... ](*,)


It is a bushing that supplies support to a load bearing point.

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby 13Fishing » Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:06 am

johnD wrote:Well , before icast they advertised it being a zero bearing reel...now they call the bushing a bearing. I am confused. :-k


zero BALL bearings guys....its the steel material, the balls, the races, and the shields that are causing so many issues within your reels. Noise, corrosion, and performance loss over time....these are a large majority of the reasons you need service. The CZB solves the issues while still delivering the performance characteristics you desire. It exceeds performance in many areas as well.

wikipedia
A bearing is a machine element that constrains relative motion to only the desired motion, and reduces friction between moving parts. ... The simplest form of bearing, the plain bearing, consists of a shaft rotating in a hole.
Bearing (mechanical) - Wikipedia

Call it a bearing, call it a bushing....no matter. It works, try it...you might be very very surprised. It took years to get this right.

Matt
13 Fishing

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby DirtyD64 » Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:23 am

13Fishing wrote:
johnD wrote:Well , before icast they advertised it being a zero bearing reel...now they call the bushing a bearing. I am confused. :-k


zero BALL bearings guys....its the steel material, the balls, the races, and the shields that are causing so many issues within your reels. Noise, corrosion, and performance loss over time....these are a large majority of the reasons you need service. The CZB solves the issues while still delivering the performance characteristics you desire. It exceeds performance in many areas as well.

wikipedia
A bearing is a machine element that constrains relative motion to only the desired motion, and reduces friction between moving parts. ... The simplest form of bearing, the plain bearing, consists of a shaft rotating in a hole.
Bearing (mechanical) - Wikipedia

Call it a bearing, call it a bushing....no matter. It works, try it...you might be very very surprised. It took years to get this right.

Matt
13 Fishing


I would be really interested to try one as a replacement for a spinning reel line roller. Since that is not an area where extremely fast speed is required, but rather continued smooth rotation is most needed, it should be a great fit. Maybe they will branch further with this special bushing's manufacture and it will make it possible to use in other brand's spinning reels.

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby 13Fishing » Fri Jan 05, 2018 12:31 pm

DirtyD64 wrote:
13Fishing wrote:
johnD wrote:Well , before icast they advertised it being a zero bearing reel...now they call the bushing a bearing. I am confused. :-k


zero BALL bearings guys....its the steel material, the balls, the races, and the shields that are causing so many issues within your reels. Noise, corrosion, and performance loss over time....these are a large majority of the reasons you need service. The CZB solves the issues while still delivering the performance characteristics you desire. It exceeds performance in many areas as well.

wikipedia
A bearing is a machine element that constrains relative motion to only the desired motion, and reduces friction between moving parts. ... The simplest form of bearing, the plain bearing, consists of a shaft rotating in a hole.
Bearing (mechanical) - Wikipedia

Call it a bearing, call it a bushing....no matter. It works, try it...you might be very very surprised. It took years to get this right.

Matt
13 Fishing


I would be really interested to try one as a replacement for a spinning reel line roller. Since that is not an area where extremely fast speed is required, but rather continued smooth rotation is most needed, it should be a great fit. Maybe they will branch further with this special bushing's manufacture and it will make it possible to use in other brand's spinning reels.


Your wish is granted.

Wait 5 weeks, the new 13 Fishing Prototype X and Prototype TX spinning reels come standard with 2 CZBs in the line roller.

Boom.
Matt
13 Fishing

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby BRONZEBACK32 » Fri Jan 05, 2018 12:39 pm

How about sending me a couple of the 3 x 10 x 4mm CZB things to test out in one of my shimano reels???

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby Cracker » Fri Jan 05, 2018 12:59 pm

Matt,

Do I need to oil those CZB's? One of the youtubers mentioned what they came kinda oily.
Any maintenance as cleaning required, and if yes, how often?

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby ScoobyDoo » Fri Jan 05, 2018 1:41 pm

13Fishing wrote:
johnD wrote:Well , before icast they advertised it being a zero bearing reel...now they call the bushing a bearing. I am confused. :-k


zero BALL bearings guys....its the steel material, the balls, the races, and the shields that are causing so many issues within your reels. Noise, corrosion, and performance loss over time....these are a large majority of the reasons you need service. The CZB solves the issues while still delivering the performance characteristics you desire. It exceeds performance in many areas as well.

wikipedia
A bearing is a machine element that constrains relative motion to only the desired motion, and reduces friction between moving parts. ... The simplest form of bearing, the plain bearing, consists of a shaft rotating in a hole.
Bearing (mechanical) - Wikipedia

Call it a bearing, call it a bushing....no matter. It works, try it...you might be very very surprised. It took years to get this right.

Matt
13 Fishing


I'll take that comment one step further.
For anyone who uses reels with ball bearings. If you oil your bearings. You are adding a mechanical form of braking in the form of hydraulic pressure. On top of that. Bearings spin at high speeds which create heat. And oils will burnish itself in the inner and outer races. For those of you that buy abec 7 bearings. Adding a drop of oil 100% decreases any benefit of gained in stepping up to a tighter tolerance bearing. And over time the porous nature of the steel races will absorb some of the oil and again a burnished layer will form.....essentially tightening the tolerances even more. Super tight tolerances aren't always beneficial especially when frames of massed produced fishing reels aren't always accurate. Another way to look at it.....think soap scum.....Soap is slippery when wet....but when it dries...it leaves behind a film. (oils are also called soaps :) ) The difference being..adding oil doesn't remove or dissolve the film
Removing that film can be difficult and often requires high water pressure, ultrasonic cleaning or high speed spins in harsh chemicals. If you just add another drop of oil. It's not going to help as it'll continually get worse.
Dry lubes like tsi 301 or tungsten disulfide work because it's a one time application and a very thin layer when applied correctly. Reapplying requires removal.

In bass fishing this takes a bit longer to show in performance than say long range conventional surf casting or tournament casting where RPMS are much higher for much longer especially when you throwing 600, 700, 800 foot distances. But it applies.

Without having even cast one. I'm willing to bet the casting performance will be more consistent over time...assuming the bearings don't deteriorate. And the possibility definitely exists that it could cast further than standard ball bearings especially this time of year. As the friction coefficient would be less than the resistance applied at speed by oil in a bearing. Now the real question is....can you now apply Tungsten disulfide to the spool shaft to really get it cooking :)
((the crazy 3 hour long 3am phone conversations you have with tournament casters who are on the other side of the globe never cease to amaze ))

On top of that..i'd bet the farm that the retrieve feel is more precise than that of a drive train supported by bearings. Upgrading to abec 5 or 7 bearings for internals does make a difference. SO if these polymer bearings lack the slop between the balls and inner and outer races...and the clickity clack the balls make when starting and stopping. The feel of the retrieve may really be something not seen in quite some time. We're talking Antares level of refinement.

Bearingless reels have been around for longer than ball bearing reels. Although the polymers used in these new reels may have a lower coeficient of friction than what's been available. Anyone who has fished in the salt for more than 20 years no doubt has fished Penn Jigmasters and Squidders.

I'm intrigued enough to have purchased one. And I'm glad the 6.3 gear ratio is offered and available.


Matt....Have you tested these bearings casting 2 ounce or heavier leads...on longer rods? Im curious if they will hold up when throwing massive distances? Say I took the reel out next week on a field. Put it on a 12 or 13' century....Loaded with 8lb braid and a shocker. And launched 120 grams....600 or so feet....Would they hold up or would bad things happen? And if something happens.....could ya send me replacements along with a plaque congratulating me for destroying the first set of bearings :) using them for purposes in which they were not intended :)

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby y2k88 » Fri Jan 05, 2018 2:13 pm

I get the thing about play/tolerances.
I wonder what the difference in friction is between a CZB, a dry BB, and a lubed BB.

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby ScoobyDoo » Fri Jan 05, 2018 2:31 pm

y2k88 wrote:I get the thing about play/tolerances.
I wonder what the difference in friction is between a CZB, a dry BB, and a lubed BB.


I bet a dry bb has less friction..and a lubed bb more friction at higher rpms

I just read the TT review. They were scratching their heads it seems about how it cast so well...yet free spooled so poorly.

That has quite a bit to do with that oil creating a hydraulic form of resitance

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Re: 13 fishing CZB Bearing

Postby RMCatchNrelease » Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:04 am

In the tackletour preview they have a close up of the CZB. The inner race if you will, looks chewed up and not very uniform. I cannot see how those imperfections would not cause vibration.

IMG_20180106_21626.jpg
IMG_20180106_21626.jpg (15.75 KiB) Viewed 1393 times


Just an observation.


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