Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Reels are the hottest topic for TackleTour. Everyone wants to know what the latest and greatest is and how they compare to the old guard. What's the best for light stuff, or what's your suggestion for heavy cover. Do we really need different retrieve ratios? It's all in here.
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Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby Dalleinf » Sat Jul 08, 2017 1:00 pm

I have just received a nib Daiwa Ryoga 1016HL.
At least 5 years old (I think) and it seems fantastic so far.
I have (too) many reels, and while I love to persuade myself that I need the newest toys, I often find it difficult to discern huge improvements from yesteryears model to this years "groundbreaking" reels at ICAST.

In which way(s) have reels improved most in the past 10-20 years? Have we seen huge improvements? Will todays metanium/conquest/steez etc. pale in comparison to reels on the market in 2030-2040?
Specifically baitcasters...
I find that spools have improved considerably - mostly due to weight reductions, which is important in my light lure trout fishing.
Your thoughts?

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby Big-Bass » Sat Jul 08, 2017 5:01 pm

I think we are at a point in many cases of diminishing returns. In fact, I will say that the build quality of reels made between 1998-2008 are arguably some of the best build bangs for the buck. In all honesty, I think the biggest improvement in reels came with Daiwa's introduction of instant anti-reverse around 1988/89. Improvements in spools have also made a difference but many will still argue that a TD-Z with the right spool or a Shimano Calais/Antares will outcast anything made today (aside from a tricked out tuned reel or maybe a DC reel). While braking (like SV) is a definite improvement, I think we have lost some of the idea of bait casters and people having to have an educated thumb to manage them. This may be from a sales perspective but also I guess it's an improvement in mainstreaming reels. Take a TD-Z Type R+ or any TD-X/TD-Z with a Steez spool and you have one of the finest reels ever made. Period. While reels will continue to incrementally improve and the prices will as well, I think what they catch the most are fishermen. And that's not always a bad thing here on TT. :D

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby Strewth » Sat Jul 08, 2017 7:12 pm

Most improvements have been incremental, rather than groundbreaking. The micro gears from shimano are very smooth, provided they are brass and in a reel with a rigid frame such as the Conquest. Daiwa's T-wing is innovative and gives quieter casts with less effort and slightly greater distance. The use of non-metal side plates and frames leads to rougher reels in my experience, so this has been a backward step. I prefer smoother, slightly heavier all-metal reels with brass gears that last a long time (non-Mg as I fish in the salt). My 5 year old Calais 100 and 15 year old (tricked up) Millionaire CVX 103A are super smooth and quiet after 100s of large fish.

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby DirtyD64 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 7:55 pm

I do think we are about to level off. Unless we jump forward major in the base of a technology (new bearing design like 13 fishing, lighter aluminum spools like Daiwa, etc.) not much will change. It takes groundbreaking discovery to birth groundbreaking change. I think over the next 10 year period, Daiwa will have SV 3D, expect similar performance to a Tatula SV/SSSV103 on control settings, and expect Zillion SV TW distance on the longcast (if not better). Tech will level off for the most part though, I do expect to get more bang for your buck though. My friend with the most expensive gear (started a successful business) says he only buys Tatula CT-R/Curado level reels because he fishes A LOT and already sees only miniscule gains versus dollar amount in the upper level versions. He fishes multiple Steez, Metaniums, higher end 13 reels, plenty. Claims there are nice features on the better ones, and still loves them, but just says the features against price ratio keeps him in the under $200 range.

If it was me I would have all Steez and Metaniums, just how I am, but I have a $20000 a year job, and only one hobby so I love the new tech in reels. The more bang for you buck improvement as the years go on is nice though.

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby GOOD YEAR 71 » Sat Jul 08, 2017 8:22 pm

I'm gonna cast my vote for outright availability. The internet has been a game changer. Simple as that.
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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby Slazmo » Sat Jul 08, 2017 11:38 pm

For me it has to be a few things that come to mind.

1 - Increased model range - when there actually isnt, a few reels with ever so slight bearing number change, ratio change, colour change and few other aesthetics and viola $100 / $600 range of reels.

2 - Planned obsolescence - where stocks of parts are reduced in time (always about the change of model), where sime critical parts are diminished - was once a guaranteed stockpile for 10 years here... Parts dont last as ling and things like bearings seem to give up the ghost quicker. There are other things like corrosion resistance which im finding got better and now seems to have gone down the toilet again...

3 - Fancy terminology - the overuse of things like "Hagane" and the myriad of other terms either to describe or loosely coin things in a reel is laughable.

I think weve hit a precipace of technologies in reels, where now it seems that the manufacturers are now deliberately stemming flow of new technologies for the future series reels. Efficiencies will increase no doubt and other minor technologies will be adapted but i think the main stream "think tank" has matured enough without depleting it for the respected companies futurability.

I honestly would like to see "new old" come back. Where companies stopped sitting on their hands and made old new reels to revive where they came from and bring back interest in the game - all this new stuff is great (to a degree), but think how good it could be if they did things like that.

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby Dalleinf » Sun Jul 09, 2017 3:21 am

Thank you for all the interesting replies guys.

Went fishing this morning in Denmark with my Daiwa Ryoga 1016 plus SLP/RCS 1016 SV G1 spool (from digitaka and jpangler) and my St Croix Legend Elite 9' ML (from St Croix webshop) - yes, the internet and availability is a huge plus.

I am sort of happy to read that most find us at a point in time with minimal improvents reel-wise, and that "old stuff" still hold up and probably will continue to do so...

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby spookybaits » Sun Jul 09, 2017 12:07 pm

Improvements/inventions that stand out to me(in no particular order:

- Spools(in general): lighter, better balanced.

- The SV spool/air braking system: pretty groundbreaking imo. The ability to easily cast finesse + bomb heavier lures on the same spool/reel, + how well it performs for skipping, + reduced backlashes(something we here probably take for granted- I have 2 buddies who swore they'd never fish baitcasters due to backlashes, until I put an alphas SV in their hands. Now they both own one).

- X-ship.

- micro gears (brass).

-Longer stock handles

- better drags

-magnesium reels(at the cost of not being salt friendly). Used to not like the hollowness but I've come to appreciate it and the way it transmits vibrations & feel.

-higher gear ratios

---Improvements & inventions that come with consequences/jury still out on/not a fan of-----

- aluminum gears. Nope. Not a fan, never will be. The cons outnumber the one pro(slightly reduced weight). Shave that weight from somewhere else(like a CF handle, or not at all because it's not a significant enough weight reduction). Not saying they don't work, just saying... I've never seen someone wish their brass gears were aluminum, or complain that brass gears don't feel as good as aluminum.

-plastic reels/sideplates (ci4+, zaion): not really a fan, but for guys who really value a lighter reel over other factors it's good.

-T-wing: good for chucking & winding applications but with baits moved by rod(topwater, jerk baits, dancing jigs, etc) the line can hop out of the groove. Also, leaders can be an issue. But it does do what it's intended to do- reduce line friction & add a little distance. (I still think using torzite as the line guide might be a viable option for reducing line friction, at least in theory).

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby mark poulson » Sun Jul 09, 2017 12:49 pm

spookybaits wrote:Improvements/inventions that stand out to me(in no particular order:

- Spools(in general): lighter, better balanced.

- The SV spool/air braking system: pretty groundbreaking imo. The ability to easily cast finesse + bomb heavier lures on the same spool/reel, + how well it performs for skipping, + reduced backlashes(something we here probably take for granted- I have 2 buddies who swore they'd never fish baitcasters due to backlashes, until I put an alphas SV in their hands. Now they both own one).

- X-ship.

- micro gears (brass).

-Longer stock handles

- better drags

-magnesium reels(at the cost of not being salt friendly). Used to not like the hollowness but I've come to appreciate it and the way it transmits vibrations & feel.

-higher gear ratios

---Improvements & inventions that come with consequences/jury still out on/not a fan of-----

- aluminum gears. Nope. Not a fan, never will be. The cons outnumber the one pro(slightly reduced weight). Shave that weight from somewhere else(like a CF handle, or not at all because it's not a significant enough weight reduction). Not saying they don't work, just saying... I've never seen someone wish their brass gears were aluminum, or complain that brass gears don't feel as good as aluminum.

-plastic reels/sideplates (ci4+, zaion): not really a fan, but for guys who really value a lighter reel over other factors it's good.

-T-wing: good for chucking & winding applications but with baits moved by rod(topwater, jerk baits, dancing jigs, etc) the line can hop out of the groove. Also, leaders can be an issue. But it does do what it's intended to do- reduce line friction & add a little distance. (I still think using torzite as the line guide might be a viable option for reducing line friction, at least in theory).


I have to agree with you on just about everything, except the Daiwa stuff, because I haven't used any. Yet.
I'd trade plastic side plates for brass gears in a heartbeat!

I test baits I make on my dock, from small poppers to whopper ploppers. I have an old BPS Rick Clunn 7' MH rod, with a Quantum E600 reel, spooled with 17lb BPS mono, leaning next to the door leading to the patio and dock. I have lighter and newer stuff on my boat, but I never seem to notice that the old reel weighs over 7 oz., or that the rod isn't feather light, when I'm out there working whatever lure I'm testing. That reel has brass gears, and just works, all the time. And, when a fish "accidentally" hits my lure, that combo always gets them onto the dock.

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby Bootytrain » Sun Jul 09, 2017 11:23 pm

Digital Control

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby LgMouthGambler » Mon Jul 10, 2017 3:05 am

They have been getting cheaper built by the years. I think the last of the good reels ended somewhere around 2008. But, overall, the biggest improvement in my eyes has been the accessibility of JDM reels through the internet. You can get some classics in really good to condition to new in box if you look.
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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby ScoobyDoo » Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:25 am

The seals of the tranx is a huge advancement as well as seals in spinning reels. As a surf and salt junkie. I bet there are as many posts discussing sealed reels on another site as there are total posts on this site. It used to be just a Van stall...then the mitchell banana. Now there are a TON in various price ranges that can take a splash and dunk.

Well syncronized locomotion levelwind systems. I prefer worm gear oscillation...But cam drivin has come a long way and can stack line beautifully.

Carbon fiber drag washers.

Instant antireverse

removal of the antireverse switch.

high carbon composites.

Dual ball bearing supported pinion gears.

forward canted gear boxes for conventional reels

bearing supported main shaft

arch shaped rotor.

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby wirinhar » Tue Jul 11, 2017 6:42 am

Dalleinf wrote:Thank you for all the interesting replies guys.

Went fishing this morning in Denmark with my Daiwa Ryoga 1016 plus SLP/RCS 1016 SV G1 spool (from digitaka and jpangler) and my St Croix Legend Elite 9' ML (from St Croix webshop) - yes, the internet and availability is a huge plus.

I am sort of happy to read that most find us at a point in time with minimal improvents reel-wise, and that "old stuff" still hold up and probably will continue to do so...


had 2 before and sold.

Now i am thinking to get it back :) \:D/ \:D/ \:D/

WW

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Re: Reelin' in the years (biggest improvement in reels?)

Postby Johnny A » Wed Jul 12, 2017 6:25 am

Availability or competition.


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