Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

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njbasscat
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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby njbasscat » Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:46 pm

diehardbassfishing wrote:Yea, Abu produced an anti-backlash reel. Designated as 5600AB. The fishing line was threaded through a spring loaded leaver (flap). When line went slack during cast (backlash potential) the released load on the line would allow the leaver to raise, applying a friction brake to the spool. It was a market failure. Even if the system worked well, this "outboard" form of cast control wouldn't be accepted well by the market.

If this new "inboard" (proper) anti-backlash system works as advertised, it could be very successful. Will be interesting to see how far this goes. Will any major manufacturers actually employ a 3rd party device into their reels? If not, maybe a reel company that isn't one of the top 3 selling manufactures, will buy in and boost their business!



"I'll give up my Magforce when you pry it from my wet, fish smelling hands"

I have to disagree with you about the 5600AB working well. It was a market failure because it was horrible.

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diehardbassfishing
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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby diehardbassfishing » Sun Mar 11, 2018 6:42 pm

I know - I said "even if it worked well..."

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby njbasscat » Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:53 am

diehardbassfishing wrote:I know - I said "even if it worked well..."

My bad.

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby diehardbassfishing » Mon Mar 12, 2018 5:29 pm

No problem.

Glad you're reading this topic. Hope we are early at seeing what makes Alphabrake tick!

Karl

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby SSS » Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:54 pm

You know what would be nice? If this breaking system is truly great, and Daiwa buys the tech. I'm tired of MagZ and the Air brake doesn't cast far enough for me. This new braking system in a made in japan reel would be :shock:

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby mark poulson » Mon Mar 12, 2018 8:01 pm

SSS wrote:You know what would be nice? If this breaking system is truly great, and Daiwa buys the tech. I'm tired of MagZ and the Air brake doesn't cast far enough for me. This new braking system in a made in japan reel would be :shock:


Buy then what would Daiwa fans have to argue about? What would happen to the "which spool?" debates? :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby SSS » Tue Mar 13, 2018 5:59 pm

mark poulson wrote:
SSS wrote:You know what would be nice? If this breaking system is truly great, and Daiwa buys the tech. I'm tired of MagZ and the Air brake doesn't cast far enough for me. This new braking system in a made in japan reel would be :shock:


Buy then what would Daiwa fans have to argue about? What would happen to the "which spool?" debates? :lol: :lol: :lol:
I'm ready to abandon magv/magz/sv. Tired of them. So if this breaking system is great, i'd be all over it, and if it stays for the years to come, we'll have plenty of spools to swap between.

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby surge » Sat Mar 17, 2018 9:45 am

The reels will be manufactured in Asia and should be avalable for purchase within a year.

Here's the patented braking system:

https://patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/detail.jsf?docId=WO2017140734&recNum=1&maxRec=&office=&prevFilter=&sortOption=&queryString=&tab=PCT+Biblio

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby Svivlo » Sat Mar 17, 2018 12:34 pm

Hi, this Patrik the founder of Svivlo. I'm here to answer your questions regarding the Alphabrake.

The brake itself will be manufactured in Sweden and the reel will be OEMed from Asia. There will be no issues with tolerances and the reel will be of good quality. We would love to manufacture the reel in Sweden but as a new startup we do not have the funding to pull this off and it would take a very long time before you could enjoy the technology.

The alphabrake has the ability to eliminate backlash under normal circumstances but we will however focus on cast length, control and minimize backlash in our first reel.

We have retrofitted Alphabrake into several reels among them an Ambassadeur 5500, a Revo Beast and a Daiwa Tatula. The latest prototype is put into an OEM reel.

The Alphabrake is invented by a watch maker who has put thousands of hours into developing this ingeniously simple construction.

/Patrik
Co-founder of Svivlo

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby TommyG » Sat Mar 17, 2018 6:02 pm

Hi Patrik, and Welcome! Always interested in the new tech.

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diehardbassfishing
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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby diehardbassfishing » Sat Mar 17, 2018 6:29 pm

Great to see you here, Patrik!
We're all anxious to learn the mechanics of this new control system. Can you give us a description of how this cast control works? What kind of mechanism controls the spool?

Karl

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby Svivlo » Sun Mar 18, 2018 12:03 am

Thank you TommyG and diehardbassfishing.

I'll do my best to explain the technology without leaving too much details as its still under development. Even though the contruction is very simple the mechancs behind it is very complex. We've showed this to physics professors who scratched their heads and didn't really grasped how it worked :D

The brake is fully mechanical and in its simplest form consists of only one moving part (as our current prototype). It uses friction to brake the spool and is activated by deceleration and the brake force is controlled by the rate of change in deceleration. We also had to explain this to the patent attorneys at Swedish Patent Office and EPO in order to get our applications through.

Here's an excerpt from our communication with them:

"Before going into detail on an analysis of novelty and inventive step in view of the cited art, the rotational friction brake of the invention will be discussed more generally, and freely, with the aim to increase the basic understanding of the invention and how it differs from rotational friction brakes of the art. In fact, the rotational friction brake of the present invention operates, especially with regards to its actuation, in a completely different way than the rotational friction brakes of the prior art, as defined in the cited documents, and is therefore also a completely different kind of brake. The rotational friction brakes of the prior art cited by the Examiner are all centrifugal rotational friction brakes, i.e. the brake is actuated by the angular speed of the rotating body. In contrast, the rotational friction brake of the invention is actuated by the rate of change of the angular speed, i.e. the time derivative of the speed, and relies on utilizing the inertia to initiate motion of the braking arm. This will for example mean that embodiments of the rotational friction brake of the invention may be arranged so as to be actuated at very low speeds but at high acceleration, or at very high speeds where acceleration goes to a deceleration etc. Such a behavior is not possible for a centrifugal rotational friction brake, which will introduce an increasing braking power as function of increasing angular speed, which results in the actuation of the brake to occur at a specific rotational speed. Furthermore, the invention enables higher angular speeds as it only applies brake force when the rotating second body is changing is rotational speed and, additionally, provides an anti-locking functionality allowing it to function in any rotational speed. This is especially needed in fishing reels to allow longer casts without backlash and is achieved through the following unique characteristics of the invention here described in terms of a fishing cast:

1. Lure is accelerated at beginning of cast and fishing line is being pulled off and accelerates the spool
2. The invention is deactivated through mass inertia during acceleration
3. The lure is decelerated by wind resistance and gravitational forces
4. Plurality of line is being fed out due to spool inertia
5. Spool inner friction causes deceleration and activates the invention through mass inertia i.e. when the line stops pulling
6. Friction applied by the invention brakes the spool and thus allow the spool to pick up any line slack
7. When all line slack is picked up the lure, through the line, accelerates the spool again
8. The invention is deactivated due to acceleration and mass center inertia

The above sequence described in points 3-8 is repeated until the rotational speed equals zero. This is totally opposite to pure centrifugal brakes as they will continuously apply brake force until rotational speed = 0 as they are activated and regulated by centrifugal forces alone."

I hope the description above clarifies things and with the conceptual image of the Alphabrake below it should be even clearer. We'll also make an English website as soon as possible.


Image
Co-founder of Svivlo

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby DirtyD64 » Sun Mar 18, 2018 2:01 am

Still interested to see how it syncs up with any current reel. I feel like I could understand better once it is on a spool, not even a specific one, just a basic drawing.

Looks like watch level precision as of now though and really interested to see how it ends up. Always love to see innovation move the market forward. I think one of the hardest physics issues is the fact that the line pulled out doesn't equate directly to spool speed, baitcasting anti backlash control is basically jerking a roll of toilet paper and figuring out how to make it stop before unwinding all your dook tickets.

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby TommyG » Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:17 am

Looks very cool, I have a Revo Beast available for testing!!!

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Re: Alphabrake - New Kind of Braking?

Postby diehardbassfishing » Sun Mar 18, 2018 7:13 am

Thank you, Svivlo!
I can see how this is not a classic centrifugal brake. I'm trying to visualize the system. Would it be fair to say the mechanical brake acts a bit like a pendulum?

Karl


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